Little one: Welcome to my Mommy’s podcast.
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Katie: Hey and welcome to “The Wellness Mama Podcast.” I’m Katie from wellnessmama.com and wellnesse.com, that’s wellness with an E on the top. And I’m right here immediately with my pal, Naveen, who’s an intensely curious entrepreneur who has been taking up some huge, audacious concepts to push humanity ahead. He’s the writer of the award-winning e-book “Moonshots: Making a World of Abundance,” and his present moonshot adventures are Viome and Moon Categorical, which is an area firm. However as a serial entrepreneur, he’s additionally based InfoSpace, Intelius, and Expertise Smart, amongst others.
And his present work is in Viome Life Sciences, which was based in 2016 with a mission of creating sickness non-compulsory by predicting and stopping power illness by way of a deeper understanding of a person’s biology at a molecular degree. And it’s constructed on an AI-driven platform that analyzes the interplay between meals, our microbiome, and our human selves to develop precision suggestions to stop and reverse power illness. He’s additionally the vice-chairman of the board at Singularity College, and on the board of XPRIZE Basis. He’s been the recipient of many issues together with Entrepreneur of the Yr, Most Artistic Particular person by Quick Firm, High 20 Entrepreneurs, and lots of extra.
On this episode, we speak in regards to the human ecosystem and customized optimization of your intestine well being and your general well being. We speak in regards to the purpose the intestine impacts your entire physique. Why it’s not simply genetics from our dad and mom however truly our ecosystem inside our intestine that controls our physique. Why 70% of the immune system is within the intestine. How microbiome stability begins at beginning and even earlier than. How 90% of serotonin is produced within the intestine, not the mind. What makes up the ecosystem of the intestine. We get fairly granular on this one.
The distinction between DNA and gene expression. How some meals will be good for some folks and never others, and tips on how to know which is finest for you, but additionally, the universally dangerous meals. Why there are some universality unhealthy ones however not universally good ones. Why he doesn’t advocate harsh merchandise that kill micro organism within the mouth or within the intestine. The true purpose it’s vital to chew your meals rather well earlier than swallowing, and a lot extra. Lot’s of sensible data on this episode. Additionally, a lot of hyperlinks to be taught extra within the present notes at wellnessmama.fm, so test these out. However with out additional ado, let’s be a part of Naveen Jain. Naveen, welcome again.
Naveen: Effectively, Katie, so good to see you lastly after a protracted, very long time.
Katie: I’m so excited we get to have a dialog and get to file it and share it immediately, and we’re gonna speak quite a bit about intestine well being and even past intestine well being, how this impacts the well being of the entire physique. Earlier than we do, although, I’d say you’re the one particular person I do know in actual life who has a Moon rock assortment. And so, I’d love so that you can simply discuss this as a result of I feel you’re my solely hobbyist Moon rock collector.
Naveen: Effectively, I feel, Katie, you realize, to me, the Moon is symbolic. It’s symbolic of what humanity is able to doing. So, to me, going to the Moon is a means of expressing that there’s nothing that’s unattainable for us to do. Although it’s known as “Moonshots” that folks thought was troublesome, if not unattainable to do and having, you realize, now to have the ability to go to the Moon and to me, the gathering of house rocks truly was simply merely a interest of in a position to maintain one thing in your hand. Which may be even earlier than the beginning of our planet. And it provides you some concept of how fragile we’re that if we don’t handle ourselves, our planet, we as humanity could not survive. As a species, we could not survive.
So, you realize, concept of when somebody says, “I’m actually anxious about our planet,” ask the planet and planet will let you know, “Don’t you are concerned about me as a result of we…” Planet will just do advantageous however human species could not survive. Similar to dinosaurs. And to me, having a Moon rock merely jogs my memory that all of us are related collectively. When one thing exterior us goes unsuitable, we as inner ecosystem can even be impacted, proper. And that’s coming right down to, you realize, when you have a look at what’s above, so beneath is de facto what’s exterior the ecosystem and the universe impacts us, and our ecosystem inside us impacts the universe.
Katie: I really like that you just mentioned it like that as a result of I interviewed my oldest son on this podcast a pair hundred episodes in the past when he launched a cookbook and you realize him as properly. And I requested him that query. You understand, your technology’s gonna face quite a bit within the environmental and local weather stuff. And, I raised this query and he goes, “Effectively, mother, you’re truly asking the unsuitable query as a result of the…”
Naveen: Oh, I adore it, I adore it.
Katie: He mentioned, “The planet is a self-correcting organism. It’s gonna heal itself. It’s only a query of whether or not we get to remain right here when it does. And we have to be asking how we will be extra synergistic inside an surroundings that’s larger than us.”
Naveen: That’s the excellent reply. That’s precisely how I’d see it that…you realize, when folks say, “Aren’t you anxious in regards to the planet?” I say, “That’s not the query you ought to be asking.” It’s, “Are we anxious in regards to the human species?” That’s what we needs to be asking.
Katie: Which is an ideal segue as a result of that’s one thing that you’re intimately concerned with and I’d say not anxious about however working to unravel. My listeners are fairly well being savvy and perceive or not less than have a passing understanding that intestine well being impacts the entire total physique. However I really feel like this idea is…properly, we’ve identified elements of it for a very long time. We’re seeing a lot extra analysis about it proper now. And we’re…because of corporations like Viome, we have now many extra tangible instruments to truly perceive and begin to do one thing about that. However to start out broad, type of give us an outline of what we imply by the well being of the intestine impacts the well being of the entire physique.
Naveen: So, properly, initially, you realize, let’s simply begin from the start. We as human beings are usually not merely a product of the DNA from our mother and pop. What we’re is a symbiotic ecosystem, and in that ecosystem, 99% of all of the genes which might be truly expressed in our human physique are usually not our personal. They arrive from these microbes which might be in our mouth, in our intestine, throughout us. So, think about…I imply, there’s actually…if we have a look at the human beings as such when it comes to all of the genes which might be expressed that makes us who we’re, they don’t seem to be people. They’re principally microbial. We’re dwelling of their world. They don’t dwell in our world, proper.
So, after we perceive that, you realize, though you may argue that they’re the puppet masters and we’re merely the host or puppet for his or her profit, and you may argue sometime that perhaps they really created us to unfold them round, perhaps they created us to allow them to rule the world, proper, however in all honesty, we coevolved collectively. In coevolution what occurs is we feed them and we give them a pleasant and heat and cozy place to remain. In flip, they feed us the vitamins that our physique wants to truly be wholesome, proper. So, think about from the time a child is born, and I feel that is one thing that most individuals don’t understand, that within the first couple of days of mom’s breast milk is filled with oligosaccharides. And that can not be digested by the human physique. That’s there just for the microbes within the intestine to have the ability to convert into vitamins. Which means it’s to create the ecosystem inside us.
Now think about what nature is telling us, that we simply created a offspring and one of the simplest ways to maintain this offspring wholesome is to not feed it however to feed them who’re going to maintain the offspring wholesome. And because the child goes by way of the beginning canal, that is the primary publicity the infant will get to the entire world of microbiome. It will get…utterly inhales the microbiome because the child’s going by way of beginning canal. And sadly, a number of the moms for apparent causes find yourself getting a C-section. They really…the infants are usually not going by way of the identical…they’re uncovered to pores and skin microbiome somewhat by way of the beginning canal, the microbiome that they’d get by way of the beginning canal. And that may be a basically…the infant, when it’s born, is definitely…the character has created in a means that the microbes get launched into the infant on the time of the beginning and that really now turns into a coevolution course of. And the mom’s breast milk begins to feed these microbes to create this ecosystem.
And because the intestine microbiome begins to get wholesome, it begins to coach our immune system. And I feel that is the elemental half that folks want to know. Seventy % of our immune system is alongside our intestine lining. In truth, all of the analysis exhibits that how intestine microbiome is consistently coaching our immune system what’s a pal and what’s a foe, proper. So, in some sense, when you have a look at the human physique, there’s a tube that goes by way of us. There’s a high of the tube in your mouth after which there’s the underside of the tube, and then you definitely begin to have a look at all alongside the strains there’s a huge quantity of microbial existence there. They usually in reality are continually interacting with our immune system and the immune system is now understanding when there may be truly a pathogen that’s coming by way of the meals or the pathogen that’s coming by way of the skin world, tips on how to react to it. And these microbes are the primary sign that tells the immune techniques, “This isn’t good. Go do one thing about it, proper.”
And I feel to me, that symbiotic relationship breaks down when there’s a dysbiosis within the intestine. So, I feel as your son identified, not simply the planet however even the human physique is designed to heal itself. The human physique is designed to be in homeostasis. And any time…and whether or not we reduce our pores and skin or whether or not there may be some kind of pathogen or we get some kind of a illness, it usually is designed to heal itself if our physique is in stability. So, when there are intestine microbial actions and the human host are continually in sync and wholesome and our immune system is wholesome, then our physique will truly heal itself. When there’s a dysbiosis or imbalance of the intestine microbiome, that is the place the unease occurs. When your physique shouldn’t be comfy, you get illness which we name illness.
Katie: Yeah, so many vital factors you simply mentioned to unpack. And I feel the primary being that we actually are extra bacterial than human and also you…right here you mentioned you’re what you eat but it surely goes up to now past that. It’s not even you’re what you eat and even you’re what you eat-eat, however what your intestine micro organism eats and the way it grows. And I really like that you just introduced up the beginning canal factor as a result of I’m a doula and I’ve truly helped in a number of C-section births with feeding the infant, as a result of such as you mentioned, when you don’t…the infant is of course meant to seed their intestine by way of the beginning canal. And if that doesn’t occur, such as you mentioned, they’re seeding to the hospital room, to pores and skin, to probably disinfectants which might be in that room, all types of issues. And we all know that this intestine micro organism at beginning, increasingly we be taught, units you up on your entire life. But in addition, the excellent news is…and I do know that Viome does quite a lot of analysis on this. All shouldn’t be misplaced when you don’t get an ideal begin. We now have the power to type of get a snapshot and look within the intestine in a very distinctive means after which optimize to enhance somebody’s well being going ahead.
And likewise, such as you mentioned, the physique’s pure state is well being. It’s not usually that we have to do something drastic. We have to get out of our personal means and simply take away the issues which might be retaining the physique from being wholesome or perhaps generally give it little further vitamins to assist get there. Discuss somewhat bit in regards to the science of Viome and what we’re testing as a result of this expertise didn’t even exist a pair many years in the past, and now we have now such wonderful information from this.
Naveen: Effectively, it’s very attention-grabbing is this concept of, you realize…when you return and have a look at couple of many years in the past, it was truly the micro organism and all these organisms had been thought-about as an enemy of the human physique. That’s the minute you see them, your job is to kill them as shortly as attainable as a result of they will’t probably be there for our good, proper. And as we began to be taught extra in regards to the human physique, we realized that the majority of those organisms are literally commensal. They’re speculated to be there and so they in reality…after we feed them issues like, you realize…in olden days, after we had been dwelling within the savannas of Africa, we’ll pull out a leaf or we’ll pull out the basis and eat it. That’s stuffed with fiber. These fibers are literally what our intestine microbes eat, and people intestine microbes, by consuming these fibers, truly flip them into quick chain fatty acids. Issues like butyric, issues like acetate, these had been all of the vitamins that our physique wanted.
In truth, when you begin to consider it, 90% of all of the serotonin is definitely produced in our intestine, not in our mind. So, when you actually take into consideration all of the issues which might be being achieved within the intestine and the way what occurs within the intestine doesn’t merely keep within the intestine, it truly impacts the entire physique together with our mind to coming again to it, Katie, that you just identified. What occurs in our intestine impacts our temper. So, whether or not it’s a despair or anxiousness or, you realize, you may name them any names you need, you realize, lots of this stuff together with autism is now related immediately into the intestine microbiome. In truth, they’ve achieved now the analysis the place they did merely a microbial transplant known as a fecal transplant and so they had been in a position to in reality present that children with autism, their autistic signs went down by 50% even after two years simply by merely doing the microbial transplant. They had been in a position to present once you took an individual that has a despair a microbial transplant or anxiousness, it may be transferred just by transferring the microbiome into one other species. They usually’ve achieved them in mice and so they’ve achieved that in reality in people, and clearly, it was achieved by mistake however that’s truly the way it occurred.
In truth, what’s actually attention-grabbing is dependancy. They usually’ve proven the identical factor. They took…there have been 17 folks on the analysis that had been utterly hooked on alcohol. And people folks, they gave them a fecal transplant from individuals who truly had no dependancy. And these folks’s dependancy went away. Now think about that, that our intestine microbiome are controlling our mind when it comes to what to do. That’s what the dependancy is, proper. And I feel that’s actually phenomenal.
And now what we’re studying is each kind of most cancers…in reality what they’ve now checked out is each single strong tumor has microbes inside that tumor. Take into consideration {that a} second, the microbes are contained in the tumor. And what we discovered most fascinating was there may be microbial peptides being displayed on the floor of the tumor. Now, why would a tumor that’s an organism eager to survive would ever show a microbial peptide until it’s there to idiot our immune system into pondering that is self and protects the tumor in opposition to the immune system attacking, proper?
Now, think about what…one other factor that’s most attention-grabbing I discovered was once you do immunotherapy, it really works about one-third of the time. And the folks the place the immunotherapy doesn’t work, within the 70% of the those who immunotherapy didn’t work, they merely had been in a position to do a change of their intestine microbiome and the identical immunotherapy began working. So, our intestine microbiome shouldn’t be solely there to maintain us wholesome from all of the ailments immediately we name the completely different names. Coronary heart ailments, it’s coming from our intestine microbes truly producing issues like trimethylamine or TMA. TMA will get absorbed within the blood and our liver converts them into TMAO, trimethylamine oxide. In truth, we will now have a look at issues like LDL manufacturing which is a foul ldl cholesterol manufacturing and see how microbial actions and microbial metabolites truly change the LDL manufacturing. You’re ready to have a look at how…what’s taking place in your intestine, how are we altering the inflammatory markers in our host. So, we’re in a position to measure the intestine exercise and the human host exercise, all their cytokines. So, we’re each interleukins, we’re the entire inflammatory markers to see how they’re altering with the intestine microbial exercise.
And so, anyway, the purpose I’m making an attempt to make is that you just talked about one thing about these micro organism, and I simply need folks to know the microorganisms are usually not simply micro organism. They’re predominantly micro organism however in addition they include yeast, viruses and even the RNA viruses or fungus or mould. All of this stuff are literally the entire ecosystem and the largest half in reality when you seen virtually 10 to 1 if no more is definitely phages. And phages are the viruses that infect the micro organism. And when you have a look at any nature whether or not you’re wanting within the swamp otherwise you’re wanting on the intestine microbiome, in reality there are 10 occasions extra phages than the micro organism alone. And meaning these viruses that infect micro organism are modifying the bacterial…the organism, the capabilities of those micro organism that in reality adjustments how these micro organism behave when it comes to what capabilities they’re performing.
So once more, what’s actually attention-grabbing is by what organisms are there, won’t ever let you know what’s going on in your physique. In truth, their capabilities are what makes the distinction. Which means what they’re producing can…is de facto the one factor that issues what these intestine microbes are producing, not who they’re. And I feel, Katie, you most likely know that quite a lot of the folks like Akkermansia muciniphila. A number of the corporations are promoting them as a probiotic with out realizing that Akkermansia will be good for some folks and actually it’s the primary purpose for inflicting a number of sclerosis, and it has additionally been immediately linked to Alzheimer’s, proper. So now give it some thought. The identical organism can do one thing good for one particular person and might do one thing actually unhealthy in one other particular person. So, taking one thing blindly, taking any complement, any probiotic, any prebiotic blindly is definitely not good for you as a result of your physique is totally completely different than different particular person’s physique. The identical organism or similar probiotic will be good for somebody and may very well be dangerous for one more particular person. And that’s the largest studying we have now had within the final six years.
Katie: Yeah, I really like that you just introduced up the fecal microbiota switch as properly. I’ve seen a number of the science on this and… you realize, caveat, this isn’t one thing to aim at house but it surely’s fairly wonderful what they’re carrying out in labs with some actually focused and really particular methods of doing that. And I really feel like in a way, that is additionally one thing you may accomplish with out having to go to that excessive if you realize what you’re working with. And for the final two years, I’ve been saying, you realize, early on in well being and wellness, I’d discover out data, learn research and be so excited and write about it, and I’ve realized increasingly during the last 15 years all the pieces is so customized and so individualized. And so now when folks ask me like, “What precisely did you do to reverse your Hashimoto’s?” I say, “You understand, I can let you know what I did but it surely’s not gonna work the identical for you. It may be an concept with the start line but it surely’s not gonna be your blueprint. Every of our blueprints is gonna be very, very completely different.”
Which is why I really like now increasingly entry to those at-home testing whether or not or not it’s issues like Viome, even now blood testing accessible at house, genetic testing simply so we will have extra data and entry. And I’ve mentioned so many occasions on right here we’re every our personal major healthcare supplier. On the finish of the day, it’s nice to work with docs however we’re every our personal major healthcare supplier. And I really feel like having instruments in our pocket that allow us be simpler at that may actually, actually make a distinction. So, let’s speak somewhat bit extra in regards to the personalization side of this as a result of I additionally am curious…you realize, I do know you mentioned all the pieces is so completely different. What’s good for one particular person could be not for one more. Are there any issues which might be type of universally unhealthy that you just’re discovering in Viome? Like, I’d put perhaps processed vegetable oils on the don’t cross record, however I’m curious what you’re seeing within the information.
Naveen: Yeah. So initially, it’s actually attention-grabbing. I feel you phrased it appropriately. There isn’t any such factor as common wholesome meals. And meaning there is no such thing as a such factor that’s good for everybody. Which means the identical meals will be good for you or unhealthy for somebody. Nevertheless, there are some common unhealthy issues you can know. So, there is no such thing as a common wholesome factor however there are universally unhealthy issues. Sugar is a type of unhealthy issues. There isn’t any one who says, “The sugar is sweet for me, proper.” In order that’s truly having a fried, you realize, fried meals. So, all fried stuff, it’s simply unhealthy for everybody. Consuming quite a lot of sugar, it’s simply unhealthy for everybody. Nevertheless, what we discover most attention-grabbing is that analyzing the human physique and analyzing primarily based on what’s going on and what’s dynamically altering in your physique…and I feel quite a lot of the people who find themselves listening to it, I would like folks to know the distinction between a DNA which is static. So when folks do their DNA check, it tells you what’s inherently there in your physique. It doesn’t let you know what is definitely happening in your physique. Which means…if, Katie, you enable me, I’m gonna clarify the DNA as a result of I feel to me lots of people get very confused about what DNA is.
So, each a part of our physique is similar DNA. Which means you have a look at my hair, you have a look at my eyes, you have a look at my tooth, you have a look at my nails, you have a look at my finger, it’s precisely the identical DNA. Then why is it we don’t have the eyes rising on my fingers and the nails rising on my head? Similar DNA. And the reply is there’s…when some genes are overexpressed, some genes are below expressed, the identical DNA can grow to be eye, similar DNA can grow to be nail, similar DNA can grow to be pores and skin, similar DNA can grow to be coronary heart cells or neurons or issues like that, proper. So, level is DNA is like an alphabet and the story you’re writing is definitely what’s being expressed. It’s known as RNA. So, RNA tells you the story that’s being written for you proper now and DNA tells you each attainable factor that may occur. And that’s one factor.
So, what we do at Viome, Katie, is we have a look at your gene expression and what gene expression tells us is what story your intestine microbes are writing. What story your human host is writing. And now I’m gonna come again and let you know…some information to share with you in the direction of the top. As soon as we perceive all that’s happening, we’re in a position to then let you know, “Hey, don’t eat broccoli or cabbage as a result of your sulfide manufacturing in your intestine is just too excessive and the sulfide want sulfates to provide sulfide and the broccoli and cabbage are very excessive in sulfate so you must reduce it down, proper.”
We will let you know that…lots of people will let you know go take vitamin B3. However vitamin B3’s truly not good for you when you’ve got excessive uric acid manufacturing. So don’t take vitamin B3 when you have excessive uric acid manufacturing. Equally, everybody will let you know, “Hey, take curcumin and turmeric. It’s actually good anti-inflammatory.” It’s. Nevertheless, when your bile acid manufacturing could be very excessive, you don’t wish to take curcumin as a result of it’s going to transform into bile salt that’s gonna trigger extra irritation. Lots of people assume by some means taking NAD or NR, and NMN which is precursor to NAD is definitely enhance your longevity. It’s true for some folks it might try this, however for others it truly will hurt you when you’ve got excessive mobile senescence, or when you’ve got excessive inflammatory exercise. You don’t wish to be taking extra NAD as a result of that’s gonna enhance the mitochondrial biogenesis that’s going to extend extra free radicals, gonna enhance excessive mobile senescence, proper.
So, the concept actually is that it’s important to be taught what is occurring earlier than you deal with your physique like a black field. And I feel you’ve mentioned it proper, that we’re simply…we’re the CEO of our personal well being. We’re those who have to know what is occurring in our physique as a result of our major care physician…I don’t learn about you, Katie. Once I go to my major care physician, by the point I begin talking, he’s already writing the prescription. I imply, actually, the phrase he says… “Oh, did you say coughing? Right here it’s. Did you say this? Give me the in poor health, I’ll provide the tablet.” And that’s all they’re merely doing. They don’t have to…they don’t care to know what’s inflicting that to occur in my physique. Like, you had Hashimoto, or when you had any kind of an autoimmune illness, the very first thing they let you know is simply take the immune suppression medicine and suppress the symptom. Not fear about what’s inflicting it, and that may be a basic downside that our healthcare system has is that our medical industrial complicated, everybody makes cash after we are sick and nobody makes cash after we are wholesome. And so, we determined to vary that. In my world of the long run, Katie, we consider that…I feel similar to you simply mentioned, the way forward for healthcare goes to be delivered at house, not on the hospitals.
And the medicines of the long run are gonna come from a farm, not a pharmacy. And that’s going to be the largest change you’ll begin to see us taking management of our personal well being. And I feel COVID has been one of many…I’d say when you look again at COVID 10 years from now, it is going to be the largest inflection level that occurred in humanity’s notion of that we as people have management our personal actions and our actions have well being penalties.
Katie: Completely. I feel so many good silver linings and instructing moments in COVID and other people spent extra time at house and with their households cooking dinner at house. There have been quite a lot of nice outcomes, as exhausting because it was for many individuals. I feel we will deal with these positives. And I really like your clarification of DNA and the way it goes past simply your genetics. It’s about how they’re expressed and the way that’s managed within the intestine. And I’d like to go somewhat bit deeper about Viome as a result of I do know I talked to you years in the past about this and also you guys have made some huge advances since then. So, discuss type of the snapshot of what Viome is testing after which how persons are making adjustments primarily based on that and what they’re seeing.
Naveen: Sure. So clearly, Katie, a few years in the past we did a intestine intelligence chart that merely measured your intestine well being. After which we realized that that was actually good but it surely didn’t inform us how these intestine adjustments had been impacting us and the human physique. And so, we now launched…about two years in the past throughout COVID truly, we launched our well being intelligence check that measures your blood and it measures your stool, and by doing the finger prick blood, so that you don’t need to go to a lab. It’s a easy finger prick blood, couple of drops of your blood. And your starch of your stool. We’re in a position to now have a look at each your intestine well being and your human host and in a position to now let you know what’s your organic age. And that tells you not solely, you realize, how properly or how poorly your physique is ageing in comparison with your chronological age.
So, to provide you an concept, I’m now gonna be 63 in September and my organic age is right down to 50. And that tells you that actually that my physique is performing on the degree after I was 50. And I really feel it. I run up the steps two stairs at a time and I’ve extra vitality than in reality I had after I was 50. And that merely tells you what your organic age is. Then we provide you with immune well being. Which means how properly are you protected in opposition to when you had been to catch flu or chilly or any kind of pathogen, how properly your physique is ready to defend itself? And that’s your immune well being. Your mobile well being. That tells you the way properly your cells are in a position to bear the issues which might be happening within the human physique. Mitochondrial well being, that’s your vitality manufacturing facility. How properly the mitochondrial well being is performing as a result of if it’s not, you get mind fog, you’re feeling fatigued, you’re feeling drained. We provide you with clearly your intestine well being.
And now that is one thing new that we’re gonna be launching in June and we’re launching a brand new product known as full physique intelligence. And for the primary time, we’re gonna be analyzing all the best way from high of your tube, your saliva, your stool and blood, all three on the similar time. And by that, we’re additionally gonna have the ability to present you some extra insights equivalent to your coronary heart and metabolic well being. We’re gonna be providing you with your mind and cognitive well being. We’re gonna have the ability to present you your oral well being equivalent to your gum well being, your tooth well being and all of the gum, you realize…leaky gum as a substitute of simply leaky intestine. We’ll have the ability to present you the way properly your boundaries of your gums are performing in order that microbes are usually not going into your blood.
And different factor we do now which we didn’t do till a few 12 months in the past is once you do a check, not solely you get your deep perception what’s taking place in your physique and never simply let you know listed here are the meals which might be good for you and right here is why. Listed here are the meals you must keep away from and why. We used to let you know listed here are the dietary supplements you must take. Now we transcend that, Katie. We’re in a position to let you know you solely want 22 milligram of berberine day-after-day. You want 17 milligram of elderberry day-after-day. You want 79 milligram amylase day-after-day. And we undergo each vitamin, minerals, herbs, meals extracts, digestive enzymes, amino acids, probiotics, prebiotics, and we actually make these for you on demand.
There isn’t any premade stuff. Consider it like a compounding pharmacy. There are robotics compounding pharmacy. It says, these capsules are being made for Katie. Go to bin quantity 17, get 17 milligram of elderberry. Go to bin quantity 29, get 27 milligram of berberine. And we actually take all of the strawberry extract right here, put this factor right here. And by the best way, as soon as we get the powder, we make the capsules and ship them off to you each month. And as your physique adjustments, we modify your dietary supplements on the similar time. So, each time you retest, we are saying, “Oh, you don’t want amylase anymore. What you actually need is butyrate now,” proper. And we actually are in a position to modify your…as your physique is altering, we adapt the vitamin that your physique wants. And people are the brand new issues that I’m tremendous enthusiastic about.
Different issues that I’m actually, actually enthusiastic about…and we have now not talked to anybody but about it. We’re gonna be launching in June additionally our most cancers detect. And that is gonna…first time as a client you’ll have the ability to spit in a tube and with 95% specificity and 90% sensitivity, we’ll have the ability to let you know when you have any oral most cancers or throat most cancers. After which we’ll have the ability to truly join you with a physician to have the ability to do one thing about it. So, if you’re above…over 50 years previous or have any historical past of smoking, vaping, chewing tobacco, you’ll have the ability to truly at house do a check and really know that you just’re not at a threat of growing a most cancers proper now. Otherwise you’re growing a most cancers proper now.
Katie: Yeah. That is so leading edge and I feel simply to focus on what you mentioned, that is actually fascinating information of principally machine studying and AI and this adaptive expertise. And since you’ve now examined hundreds and hundreds, most likely tons of of hundreds of individuals, then the algorithm has entry to all this data so it will possibly proceed to get increasingly specialised and direct with the suggestions and be taught your personal physique over time. So, you’re getting this type of ongoing, correct image which I feel is so fascinating.
Naveen: Yeah. So, Katie, we have now analyzed over 350,000 samples already. And that has given us this…you realize, the a part of being the…a part of that Viome ecosystem is each single one that joins profit from the opposite 350,000 samples that we have now analyzed and so they contribute to the ecosystem, and our AI and machine studying is consistently getting higher. And for each single one that joins profit themselves and advantages the humanity on the similar time as a result of now the extra we be taught, the higher suggestions we will make for everybody. So, earlier than we simply solely might have a look at your stool. Now we have a look at stool plus blood. Now it’s stool plus blood plus saliva. And we’re gonna launch…the subsequent factor will likely be with urine. After which we’re gonna begin to have a look at different biomarkers in your physique. So, our suggestions get increasingly exact as we be taught increasingly in regards to the human physique. And our actual hope is, you realize, in my lifetime we’ll have the ability to perceive what causes the onset of a power illness and what causes them to progress and to have the ability to stop them from taking place within the first place, to diagnose them early once they truly do occur, and to provide you with a remedy for these ailments. Not merely handle them however to remedy them as soon as for all for every particular person. And that’s going to be the final word purpose of our life.
Katie: And I really like that you just introduced up the interplay of all of the completely different microbiomes inside the physique as properly and the way you’re all of those, as a result of a few of my early analysis was in oral well being and studying as an illustration that strep mutants and the micro organism that trigger gingivitis don’t each exist on the similar time. And it’s because we have now an oral microbiome. And if it will get out of stability in a single path or the opposite, you’re gonna find yourself with these issues. However the reply shouldn’t be sterilizing your mouth and killing all micro organism similar to we wouldn’t wish to within the intestine. It’s getting a wholesome oral microbiome that has that ecosystem that it wants. Similar factor with the intestine. And such as you mentioned, you’re these all through the entire physique. I do know your daughter’s additionally doing a little fascinating analysis with the vaginal microbiome and I’m excited to talk together with her about that.
However I feel, like we talked about to start with, since our physique is extra bacterial than human, the extra we perceive about these interactions, the extra type of intricate information we will get to make enhancements over time and naturally there could be a most cancers connection right here. You understand, I’ve heard it mentioned that most cancers is a metabolic illness in some half. And it is a means of…as a result of even inside a person, when you’re a metabolic illness, you’re , “Okay, we have to get blood sugar in test. We have to get blood stress in test. We have to get weight problems measures in test.” However the best way to try this’s gonna be completely different for each single particular person.
Naveen: I feel it’s a metabolic and inflammatory illness. So, I imply, it’s induced…power irritation is a root reason behind power ailments. Nevertheless, what causes the irritation in our physique is completely different for every particular person. So though it’s the irritation that could be on the root trigger however the underlying causes for that irritation are very, very completely different. And as you talked about, our daughter is, you realize…has this firm known as Evvy, E-V-V-Y, which appears to be like on the vaginal microbiome. And to me, what she’s doing is so phenomenal and particularly your viewers, each single lady ought to try this as a result of that’s actually…goes to be…you realize, a lot of girls endure by way of lots of the ailments that we as males would by no means perceive. And that to some extent is, you realize, largely reproductive organ and lots of the occasions the later analysis exhibits that vaginal microbiome is concerned in preterm beginning, within the well being of the infant and all of the issues that you just talked about because the child goes by way of the beginning canal. All of the issues that come out in reality are contributory from the vaginal microbiome. So, my excessive suggestion…once more, I’m biased. I feel each lady needs to be doing the Evvy check, proper.
Now, coming again to the stuff you talked about that, you realize, human well being is complicated however as soon as we perceive biochemical degree what’s going on, that’s the rationale as a substitute of organisms and as a substitute of DNA, we centered on the gene expression or RNA. We centered on what microbes are producing. Trying on the entire physique. And I feel, Katie, I wanna level out that the merchandise that you just construct for oral well being are a number of the finest merchandise as a result of, to me, what’s the largest gamechanger is folks thought the organisms had been your enemy. So, they’ve this Listerine. Kills 99% of all of the micro organism in your mouth. For heaven’s sake, don’t try this. While you kill the ecosystem in your mouth, it truly destroys the entire digestive tract. And I wanna simply emphasize, you realize, to folks when our moms instructed us to chew our meals, she didn’t ask us to chew the meals as a result of they thought the meals was too huge to go down our esophagus, proper. It was truly was once you chew your meals, you’re permitting the oral microbiome in your saliva to truly predigest the meals, and by predigesting the meals…along with predigesting, it additionally sends the sign to the intestine and to the physique about what’s coming down. So, when it tastes candy, it begins to launch the sign for pancreas to launch the insulin, as a result of it is aware of the candy stuff is coming down.
So, the principle factor is that we have to enable the oral microbiome to predigest the feed so your small gut can now take up the vitamins which might be already predigested. So, when you’re…so two issues you could take into consideration right here. And one is when you’re burdened and you’re consuming your meals, it doesn’t get correctly digested and right here is why. If you find yourself burdened, you’re in a struggle or flight response. And the primary factor that occurs once you’re in struggle or flight response is your digestive system shuts down. Bear in mind why it was designed. While you’re working away from a tiger, at the moment, the physique knew there is no such thing as a level worrying about digesting your meals as a result of both you’re gonna be lunch for another person otherwise you’re going to outlive. And when you grew to become lunch for another person, it didn’t matter. And when you survive, guess what? The stress went down and also you moved from sympathetic mode to parasympathetic mode and you may digest your meals.
While you come from work and you’re burdened, what will we inform folks? Earlier than you eat, do the gratitude. Why is that? It’s since you wish to carry your physique from sympathetic mode into parasympathetic mode. Eliminate struggle or flight response. By taking the deep breath, by doing the gratitude, what you’re doing is definitely permitting your physique to have the ability to be able to digest the meals. Then once you chew your meals, you’re permitting your saliva and oral microbiome to truly predigest your meals. And these are easy strategies we discovered within the historical tradition however we now know scientifically why did they are saying that, proper. We inform…like, Katie, chances are you’ll not know that my mother and pop and our faith, they don’t eat after sundown. And I all the time surprise why would that be. And it seems as a result of you could have three or 4 hours of break after you eat meals earlier than you fall asleep. So, they made that as a faith don’t eat after sundown so as a result of folks will get three, 4 hours of digestion. So, in reality telling that, you realize…and that to me was actually the factor that we discovered as a part of our tradition. Really, seems we’re very scientific.
And I wanna come again to the oral merchandise. I feel folks have to be actually fascinated with oral microbiome well being and utilizing the precise oral toothpaste, oral issues that…you realize, probiotics. And the merchandise, a number of the merchandise that you’ve, Katie, are designed to reinforce your oral well being and oral microbial actions or oral microbial ecosystem in your mouth. And I feel everybody who’s listening to it to start out concentrate as a result of that’s the primary. Your mouth truly is the start of your digestive tract. It isn’t merely a gap to your digestive tract. It’s the path of the digestive tract the place the digestion occurs.
Katie: I completely agree. I feel very multifaceted however begin with the mouth is so vital. And I really like a few the stuff you simply talked about about why we don’t digest meals if we’re burdened and we all know, in fact, that Individuals dwell in a power state of stress usually. And one factor I’ve grow to be keen on…you realize, there’s a purpose many cultures additionally pray or meditate proper earlier than consuming, which additionally helps the physique get into parasympathetic or you may merely do respiratory workout routines. Do some field respiratory to calm your nervous system. I really like that your loved ones naturally from a spiritual perspective stopped consuming at sundown. I’ve discovered in my very own life that I do nice after I time restricted eat and for a very long time I’d wait and never eat until midday after which eat later within the day. And I seen after I shifted that to consuming and stopping by sundown, I really feel so significantly better and it goes to that time you talked about about letting your physique end digesting earlier than you sleep in order that once you’re sleeping, you will be therapeutic and your physique can get into autophagy and you may allocate assets to all of the pure processes the physique has inbuilt to maintain us wholesome.
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And I additionally wanna piggyback on what you mentioned about the identical purpose we don’t wanna kill our oral microbiome is identical purpose we don’t wanna kill our intestine micro organism as properly however I nonetheless see folks type of hopping on the bandwagon of those actually harsh cleanses or in fact folks generally take antibiotics for causes whether or not they should or not. And people can each have a fairly harsh influence on the intestine. And so, I’d love to speak about it. Perhaps if somebody is aware of they’ve been on antibiotics earlier than or they know they’ve a intestine concern associated to actually type of killing a few of these good micro organism. Clearly, Viome helps with this however type of, like, what will be achieved? How can we assist repair it?
Naveen: So, very first thing is, you realize, earlier than you go begin taking quite a lot of issues is to know, what’s the state of your intestine micro organism? So do a Viome check, perceive the place it stands. And then you definitely begin to have a look at what you…you realize, we let you know what are the meals you must eat. And once more, taking quite a lot of the fermented meals particularly once you’re making an attempt to repopulate or rebootilate your intestine microbiome, actually the issues needs to be diversification. So as a substitute of simply taking one kind of probiotics, you ought to be taking kombucha, the kimchi, the…you realize, all of the fermented meals you may probably get your fingers on. So, whether or not it’s a yogurt or, you realize, not less than oat milk yogurt when you can. I imply, I’m a giant fan that I feel dairy…in reality for lots of the folks, dairy is the large downside. Now I’m not saying it’s for everybody however quite a lot of the folks, dairy may very well be a giant downside. And the mammalian merchandise truly may very well be a giant downside for some folks and never for others.
So, I’m not the one that is preaching veganism right here in any respect. What I’m saying is know what is sweet for you. There are lots of people who can eat crimson meat for all of their life and dwell to be 100, and the rationale for that’s crimson meat incorporates clearly as you all know, choline and carnitine that may get transformed by our intestine microbiome into issues like TMA. And I discussed TMA is the one which will get absorbed within the blood, causes the TMAO which causes the center illness. So, it’s not the crimson meat that causes the center illness. It’s the byproduct of how the crimson meat is digested in some those who produce TMA. So, in case your TMA manufacturing is low, you must eat crimson meat if you wish to as a result of it’s not gonna hurt you. And that’s actually the purpose is to know, don’t merely ban meals and entire class of meals.
One other factor that we discovered…we revealed a paper having analyzed over 100,000 folks at the moment on ageing. And what we discovered, Katie, that you could be discover actually fascinating is individuals who had been on these fad diets like, you realize, keto weight-reduction plan or paleo weight-reduction plan had been the worst offender of their organic age. The individuals who had been on keto weight-reduction plan in reality had been three to 5 years older than their chronological age and the identical is true for paleo weight-reduction plan. It seems that people who find themselves on balanced weight-reduction plan, meaning they had been consuming their carbs however not quite a bit however they had been consuming their regular carbs, they had been consuming their protein, they had been consuming their fats and so they had been consuming the protein, they had been far more balanced, had been truly higher off biologically than slicing out the entire nutrient group utterly.
Katie: That is sensible, that we’d like the range. And I’ve discovered increasingly as properly that I feel the simplistic model all of us discovered, hopefully discovered at school was about simply type of energy in, energy out. And I’ve heard it mentioned, you realize, our physique’s not a checking account. It’s a chemistry lab. And so, I now attempt to eat for maximal micronutrient and nutrient density in meals, not simply hitting or not hitting goal calorie ratios as a result of it’s a lot extra various and vital than that.
And what’s subsequent for Viome? I’m curious as a result of I do know you’re continually doing analysis right here, and such as you mentioned, your purpose is to sort out power illness in its entirety. So, what’s within the pipeline for you guys?
Naveen: Really, I discussed that subsequent check we’re launching in June is a full physique intelligence. We’re launching a most cancers detect check. And we’re making our dietary supplements and probiotics increasingly exact for each particular person since we make it for every particular person. We’re, you realize, making an attempt to do extra checks now and our purpose is to launch within the subsequent six months one other check which is gonna be extra, like, a proteomics check as a result of the issues we can not see within the blood as a result of they’re produced someplace else. So, can we measure issues, you realize, the proteins for a Hashimoto illness? Can we measure issues like lipopolysaccharide binding protein that may predict when you have a leaky intestine by LBP, by CRP which truly is finished within the liver? So, we’re going to have the ability to truly measure extra issues along with simply those that we’re measuring, and the extra data we will be taught, the higher suggestions we make. So, our hope is to proceed to launch these checks that give us higher and higher insights and meaning we will make increasingly exact suggestion for every particular person.
Final purpose actually is to know…as you say, the human physique is a chemistry lab. We now have principally biochemical reactors in our physique. Your physique is a biochemical reactor. And that’s the factor folks want to know that the gene expression tells you what biochemistry is occurring within the physique. And that’s a purpose…and actually, Viome is the one firm that does have a look at the gene expression as a result of there is no such thing as a different firm that has this expertise. And I feel individuals who have listened to your earlier podcast, we talked about, this explicit expertise got here out of Los Alamos Nationwide Lab the place that they had the laboratory for biodefense challenge. And that’s the rationale nobody else can do it as a result of it took 10 years and multibillion {dollars}’ price of assets to develop this expertise. Sadly, we had been very lucky to have the ability to get the license to have the ability to use this expertise to assist the humanity get higher. And if our mission was merely to earn a living, we’d not have been in a position to license this expertise, proper.
So, the actual fact immediately we’re merely centered on making each single particular person be higher. You understand, our mission on day one was what if we might perceive the human biology at a molecular degree so we will stop, diagnose early and remedy these power ailments together with most cancers and ageing? And I feel quite a lot of the individuals who have heard you and I speak previously, you realize that I misplaced my dad to most cancers and that was one of many largest motivator for me as a result of if I had began this firm half a decade earlier than I did, I might have probably saved my dad. And, you realize, having watched him undergo that ache or struggling by way of most cancers I noticed that though I couldn’t save him, I might dedicate my life to saving everybody else. And that will likely be my means of letting him know that, you realize, I’m so happy with what he…how he raised us as a baby and giving us all the pieces we have now so we’re in a position to save everybody else’s family members whether or not it’s from coronary heart illness or diabetes or despair, anxiousness or most cancers.
And my hope actually is that in our lifetime we’ll completely eradicate most cancers from the human physique. And if I had been to make a prediction immediately, I’ll let you know inside a decade I feel we’ll do away with most cancers from the human physique.
Katie: That’s a giant declare and I hope we’re on observe for that as properly. I’ve misplaced two prolonged members of the family within the final couple of months alone to most cancers in addition to a few of my grandparents. And it’s no secret that these are all nonetheless very a lot on the rise proper now and I’m certain the power stress of the final couple of years shouldn’t be serving to that downside. So, I’m grateful that there are assets such as you, and I’ve achieved Viome. I’m doing an up to date one proper now so I can report again with my outcomes on that. However I additionally am gonna be sure that…I do know you’ve provided a reduction code for the Viome testing. In order that hyperlink will likely be within the present notes for you guys listening at wellnessmama.fm. Yow will discover the low cost code and the hyperlink on to it there. And to verify I respect your time, there’s a pair final questions I’d like to ask you. The primary being if there’s a e-book or quite a few books which have profoundly influenced your life. And in that case, what they’re and why?
Naveen: Yeah, so the e-book that actually influenced me…there’s a e-book by Clayton Christensen, you realize. I really like the person and I noticed him earlier than he died. The e-book he wrote, “How Will You Measure Your Life?” And to me it was such a profound e-book which tells you that it’s important to be 100% sincere. You can’t be 99% sincere as a result of as soon as you are taking a step down of this honesty, it’s a slippery slope and there’s no stopping it. When you make an exception to one thing, there’s simply no going again however there’ll all the time be one more reason to make an exception. And so, it’s important to focus your self to by no means, ever compromise in your rules that you just stand for. And that was simply completely a fabulous e-book I learn.
You understand, the e-book that additionally…I imply, clearly I wrote a e-book known as “Moonshots” that’s actually about making a mindset of abundance somewhat than a mindset of shortage. And the elemental perception that I’ve is that there’s nothing that people are usually not able to doing if we truly get our mindset to consider we will. So, any time when somebody says, “I can or I can’t,” it’s true as a result of it’s as much as them to resolve whether or not they can or they will’t. That when you consider one thing is unattainable, it turns into unattainable for you and nobody else. And so, you’re utterly in management. The one factor you may’t do is what you may’t think about. Every little thing else is feasible.
Katie: I really like that. I do know you and I each elevate our youngsters with that mindset and yours are older and doing wonderful issues out on this planet already and mine are to start with levels of that. And lastly, what parting recommendation would you want to depart with the viewers immediately? Could possibly be associated to one thing we’ve talked about or fully unrelated.
Naveen: I’d say dream so huge that folks assume you’re loopy. Which means by no means let somebody let you know you can’t do it. Fall in love with your self as a result of the day you fall in love with your self is the day the world will fall in love with you. Loving your self shouldn’t be about being self-conceited. Loving your self is about not searching for another person’s approval to do the issues that imply quite a bit to you. Comply with your coronary heart, observe your intestine, hearken to your intestine and observe what it tells you. Discover a goal in life. When you discover a goal in life, you’ll by no means ever assume it’s work. I stand up day-after-day at 4 a.m., and that’s my recommendation to everybody. Everytime you stand up within the morning, when you’re not leaping out of the mattress, you must stop what you’re doing as a result of that’s not your calling, as a result of once you discover your calling, you’ll not be mendacity down within the mattress. You soar out of the mattress with pleasure wanting to unravel that downside.
And, Katie, I simply wish to reiterate, I met your children and I do know I keep in mind the oldest one and I gave him the Moon rock at the moment. I’m telling you your children are going to truly transfer this humanity ahead. You might be elevating these kids with the mindset that all the pieces they wish to do, they will. And each mom who’s listening to it simply ought to know that parenting is definitely very counterintuitive. And, Katie, you and I’ve talked about it quite a lot of occasions. Like, after we elevate our kids, we inform them, “Our love for you is unconditional however our approval shouldn’t be.” And what meaning is just is that we’ll all the time love you, we’ll all the time be there for you, however I’m not gonna let you know I’m happy with you until you do issues that make us happy with you. And that’s actually the factor about telling the kids that their success won’t ever be measured by how a lot cash they’ve within the financial institution. It will likely be measured by what number of lives they enhance. And the humility is an indication of success as a result of when you nonetheless have iota of conceitedness left in you, meaning you’re nonetheless making an attempt to show one thing to your self or another person. And humility tells you now not have to try this, proper. And that may be a true signal of success. And all I can say is I’m so happy with each one among your kids, Katie. And I can not anticipate them to develop up and really do issues that may make our kids’s and grandchildren’s life higher.
Katie: Oh, thanks a lot for saying that. Individuals who don’t know, you and I first met and actually bonded over truly parenting earlier than we ever talked about well being. And we share that similarity. I inform my children day-after-day, “I really like you unconditionally and there’s nothing you ever need to do to earn my love and there’s nothing you may ever do that may take away from my love.” However you’re proper. Additionally, I would like that, like, their pleasure to come back from within, like…and I inform them usually, “You should really feel actually happy with how exhausting you labored and you could…” As a result of I would like them to have that inside them and that self-love.
And because of this I’m so grateful each single day that I get to speak to our viewers that’s listening immediately of mothers, as a result of I feel mothers have such a tremendous distinctive potential to actually shift the way forward for humanity by how we mum or dad our youngsters and by serving to type these future leaders. And for individuals who aren’t already aware of you, I’d encourage you to hearken to our previous interview since you inform extra of your story in that one and also you very a lot stroll the stroll of this, of getting constructed all these wonderful issues after which now serving to your children on their life journeys and your spouse in her personal proper is unimaginable as properly. So very grateful on your entire household and for all that every one of you’re doing on this planet and on your time immediately. I understand how busy you’re and I’m so grateful you took the time to be right here.
Naveen: Oh, Katie, it’s all the time an honor and a pleasure to be talking with you, and I’m wanting ahead to our subsequent dialog.
Katie: And thanks, as all the time, to all of you for listening and sharing your most useful assets, your time, your vitality, and your consideration with us immediately. We’re each so grateful that you just did. And I hope that you’ll be a part of me once more on the subsequent episode of the “Wellness Mama” podcast.
When you’re having fun with these interviews, would you please take two minutes to depart a score or evaluate on iTunes for me? Doing this helps extra folks to search out the podcast, which suggests much more mothers and households may gain advantage from the data. I actually admire your time, and thanks as all the time for listening.
